"Chirp" from 2014 PCX when accelerating hard from a stop

[TheMaverick]

Hi Folks,

2014 PCX 150; 30,000km.

Of recent I've noticed a sound coming from the drive train when I accelerate hard from a standing start. It only ever used to do it occasionally, but now it's getting far more frequent. Originally I thought it sounded a bit like a belt slipping momentarily, but unless I'm mistaken, I believe that the belt is toothed and would thus make a hell of a racket if it were that that was slipping - so would I be correct in assuming that it's probably the clutch wearing out?

Difficult to describe the sound - I wouldn't call it a "chirp" - perhaps more like the sound one gets from a slipping fan belt on a car, but at a much lower frequency - and it only ever lasts around a second. Does it every time I accelerate hard off the line now, usually doesn't do it if I accelerate away gently. Never does it once clutch is fully engaged. Bike has just passed 30,000 km - has had regular oil changes (inc rear), but the belt hasn't been replaced yet. No idea what condition the belt is in, although when it was in it's low 20,000km the dealer said it was showing signs of wear.

Any thoughts people?

Many thanks,

Cheers,

Colin

[alx123]

At 30000kms I'll stop wondering and just change everything in there. Variator set and clutch, belt, drive oil. Imho

[TheMaverick]

At 30000kms I'll stop wondering and just change everything in there. Variator set and clutch, belt, drive oil. Imho

Thanks. Would be nice to in an ideal world, but it sounds rather expensive - they quoted me NZD $160 just for the belt. What sort of $$$ are we talking for clutch and variator set (drive oil was changed recently).

[alx123]

I apologize, I didn't realized where youre from. If you can buy online it will be much cheaper I guess. You might be able to get away with changing the belt and the clutch lining. Maybe rollers too, theyre inexpensive in ebay.

Let's wait for answers from guys near you though.

[homie]

Belts are $25.00 - clutch shoes are $23.00
http://www.bikebandit.com/oem-parts/201 ... #sch794095

You have that cross over year where you might have a 2013 design or you might have an LED PCX. If it's the case you have LED lights shop 2015 parts.

[alx123]

Belts are $25.00 - shoes are $23.00
http://www.bikebandit.com/oem-parts/201 ... #sch794095

this.

And you can even include the clutch set purchase..

[TheMaverick]

Belts are $25.00 - clutch shoes are $23.00
http://www.bikebandit.com/oem-parts/201 ... #sch794095

You have that cross over year where you might have a 2013 design or you might have an LED PCX. If it's the case you have LED lights shop 2015 parts.

Thanks for that - looks awesome. Mine is the non-LED version (we knew that as the 2015 model - but only available here towards the end of 2015, and I bought early 2015 - darn it).

I assume bikebandit.com are A-OK to deal with?

From what I've been reading online, my best bet is possibly ordering a new belt, new clutch plates, and new rollers for the variator - does that sound about right? I understand though that the clutch plates need a special tool to compress the springs - can anyone advise me more on that?

I spoke with the dealer today - said I'd be up for around 3 hours labour (close to NZD $300) and - depending on what needed replacing - probably another NZD 300 to 500 in parts. Not really "feeling the love" with that approach I have to say ...

[homie]

Not "feeling the love" with that approach I have to say ...

It's all labor and not really that much labor plus more a labor of love for the bike... so lets not try, lets do!

There are many ways to get at that clutch without an expensive tool, eggman being the last to come up with a hole in a board. So don't let the clutch scare you off a fun and informative restoration of your CVT. Order everything under the cover and let's get with it!

variator & boss bearing
rollers
belt
entire clutch assembly since there is a bearing in there that has an expiration date.

OR

the budget fix
rollers
belt
clutch shoes & eggmans hole in a board

OR

poor mans fix
sand the clutch shoes
replace the belt
hope the rollers are not the problem

[TheMaverick]

Thanks for that - I think I'll go with the budget fix for now, and throw in a replacement air cleaner on the side (literally!).

I thought variators had 6 rollers - is this the right part? http://www.bikebandit.com/oem-parts/det ... sch=794095 (says need 3).

[homie]

I thought variators had 6 rollers - is this the right part? http://www.bikebandit.com/oem-parts/det ... sch=794095 (says need 3).

Parts catalog attached... but it's for later model PCX. The number might have changed from earlier models but I don't think the stock weight will be different. Somebody give him the right part catalog if you have it. A set is six not three.

Page E-16 part # 22123-K36-T00 ROLLER SET, WEIGHT

[PCX150Rider]

I've always had good service from Bike Bandit. They ship UPS International if you need something but you'll have to contact them about how much it will cost.

[TheMaverick]

I've always had good service from Bike Bandit. They ship UPS International if you need something but you'll have to contact them about how much it will cost.

I wanted to see how much freight would be (often that's the "killer" for us here in NZ) so I took the checkout wizard a few more steps for just the belt ... and they offered 3 shipping options. I forget what they were called (appeared to be just the "usual suspects") but the cheapest was USD $20 for 1 to 3 weeks delivery, which is fine.

I'm thinking of starting with just the belt since it's probably due anyway, and it'll get me into working in that area where I can get a better feel for what I'm doing.

One more question if I may? It's probably time I changed the air filter as well; I took it off a few thousand km back, but after I'd taken out the 8 or so screws and removed the whole air cleaner assembly from the side of the PCX, it didn't strike me as obvious as to the filter element part being removable - I'd assumed that the whole external assemble was replaceable. Now, looking at the online diagram on Bike Bandit, it looks like just the filter element is replaceable. Could someone please confirm that this is in-fact the case?

Many thanks!

Cheers,

Colin

[you you]

Hi Folks,

2014 PCX 150; 30,000km.

Of recent I've noticed a sound coming from the drive train when I accelerate hard from a standing start. It only ever used to do it occasionally, but now it's getting far more frequent. Originally I thought it sounded a bit like a belt slipping momentarily, but unless I'm mistaken, I believe that the belt is toothed and would thus make a hell of a racket if it were that that was slipping - so would I be correct in assuming that it's probably the clutch wearing out?

Difficult to describe the sound - I wouldn't call it a "chirp" - perhaps more like the sound one gets from a slipping fan belt on a car, but at a much lower frequency - and it only ever lasts around a second. Does it every time I accelerate hard off the line now, usually doesn't do it if I accelerate away gently. Never does it once clutch is fully engaged. Bike has just passed 30,000 km - has had regular oil changes (inc rear), but the belt hasn't been replaced yet. No idea what condition the belt is in, although when it was in it's low 20,000km the dealer said it was showing signs of wear.

Any thoughts people?

Many thanks,

Cheers,

Colin

Wheelspin if you are "gunning" it?

[homie]

One more question if I may? It's probably time I changed the air filter. It looks like just the filter element is replaceable. Could someone please confirm that this is in-fact the case?

This post was for you to see today.
http://www.hondapcx.org/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=7802

The belt is always good to replace, the rollers of course are under tremendous load. But for your specific complaint don't lose sight of the target culprit... the clutch shoes. You should go straight for the clutch outer bell and get a look at the shoes. You can do that right now. Clean the race and sand the shoes, take a good look at the belt, close it back up and see if your first issue is fixed while you wait for new parts.

Here is your replacement cartridges on Ebay
http://www.hondapcx.org/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=7802

[TheMaverick]

The belt is always good to replace, the rollers of course are under tremendous load. But for your specific complaint don't lose sight of the target culprit... the clutch shoes. You should go straight for the clutch outer bell and get a look at the shoes. You can do that right now. Clean the race and sand the shoes, take a good look at the belt, close it back up and see if your first issue is fixed while you wait for new parts.

Here is your replacement cartridges on Ebay
http://www.hondapcx.org/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=7802

Thanks for the continued help Homie - much appreciated.

Unfortunately, the eBay link appears to be a repeat of the (excellent) YouTube vid, but not to worry - I'll just order a filter element and seal with some other stuff and worry about that later.

I'm still none the wiser with variator rollers from Bike Bandit - starting to think they're not listed as it just doesn't seem to add up to 100% from what I'm seeing - would appreciate any guidance anyone could offer with that.

I think at this stage I'll get the belt and clutch plates (plus filter element and seal) on their way - if I need to pay for separate freight for rollers later on then so be it.

For what it's worth, I've had the shudder you mention from about 5000km onwards; it started doing it only when the bike/transmission was cold, but then started doing it even as things warmed up. It stayed the same through about 25,000 km - still there now (just passed 30,000 km), but if anything it's got slightly better over time. I've given up worrying about it. I quite often have my adult daughter on the back -- doesn't seem to have made anything better nor worse.

One thing that does intrigue me though -- with this sound that I'm getting as I pull away from a stop ... the more aggressive the getaway, the more it makes the sound - but - if I hold the back brake on hard and give it a rev I can't make it do it (which surprises me) - so really not sure what's going on - guess I'll find out soon enough!

[Mel46]

Doesn't Chicaboo live in Australia? He would be the ideal person to talk to about what and where to get parts for your pcx. I know that it is difficult to get some parts down there in NZ because of shipping, but while you are changing out parts you may as well get some 13 gram rollers, which will give you better pickup when you start up. I would recommend NCY parts, which is what I use, but he has mentioned that others are more readily available down there. Is he still around?

[TheMaverick]

Doesn't Chicaboo live in Australia? He would be the ideal person to talk to about what and where to get parts for your pcx. I know that it is difficult to get some parts down there in NZ because of shipping, but while you are changing out parts you may as well get some 13 gram rollers, which will give you better pickup when you start up. I would recommend NCY parts, which is what I use, but he has mentioned that others are more readily available down there. Is he still around?

Thanks for the reply. Luckily, the freight situation seems to have improved a lot in recent years; there are still some downright scary figures (over $100 for anything), but also alternatives that are far more reasonable (some as low as 69c) (not a typo).

I'll probably just stick with OEM parts - to be honest, I find the bike just so perfect in every way there's nothing I really want to change about it.

[TheMaverick]

Update:

I've ordered some parts from Bike Bandit (belt, air filter element, clutch shoes), but have to admit to being a bit nervous about them. They've had my money for a few days now and yet no tracking number and no record of the order on my account. I initially checked out as a guest, but the site said if I create a login using the same eMail address then everything would snap into place; well I did, and it didn't. Additionally, I eMailed them to ask if the part number I quoted was the variator rollers for my machine - they replied (in rather poor English) that I needed 3 of them ... and I subsequently found that I was looking in the wrong section altogether - so their answer was 100% incorrect - not a great confidence builder. No problem with the daily eMail assault from them though!

I'm suspecting my original issue is probably a slipping belt at the variator end - am I correct in assuming that although it's a toothed belt, it's only driven with the teeth at the clutch end?

Looking forward to exploring this area of the bike more - but am holding off for now due to the need to buy a torque wrench first.

[homie]

Maveric, there are no teeth like typically one would think on a chain drive in the CVT (continuously variable transmission). There is just drive faces (pulleys) and a drive belt. Either the belt is smooth on the outside 2013 and earlier models or (cogged) after 2013 which means there are teeth but they only serve to allow better flexibility they do not drive anything. So to be clear everything is free to slip on it's contact points in the design. The example below is a (cogged belt) in action. I will be curious to see which belt you have on the transition year 2014 PCX



Pay no attention to this guys complaint, this is how a cogged belt acts without a load.

[TheMaverick]

Maveric, there are no teeth like typically one would think on a chain drive in the CVT (continuously variable transmission). There is just drive faces (pulleys) and a drive belt. Either the belt is smooth on the outside 2013 and earlier models or (cogged) after 2013 which means there are teeth but they only serve to allow better flexibility they do not drive anything. So to be clear everything is free to slip on it's contact points in the design. The example below is a (cogged belt) in action. I will be curious to see which belt you have on the transition year 2014 PCX



Pay no attention to this guys complaint, this is how a cogged belt acts without a load.

Thanks Homie - I appreciate the follow up.

To date I've only seen a number of videos - once I get the cover off mine I'm sure the gaps in my working knowledge will get filled in pretty quick. Doesn't sound like my (slowly getting worse) "chirp" will be too hard to solve. Bike is coming up on 31,000km now and Honda say the belt should have been replaced at 25,000km - so it's probably "in the zone" for replacement anyway - so it's really just a question of what else needs replacing in that area.

I think for all intents and purposes mine is a 2013 model. I got it in early 2015 having been told it was the 2014 model, but by all accounts there wasn't a 2014 model per sec. It's definitely not the 2015 model that has LED lighting.