Have you had the clutch bearing failure yet?

[ScooterMan]

Ok, so I've been seeing some posts from a few recently and it has me worried since I own 2 of these little beauties, and the relatively low mileage at which the failures have been occuring is disconcerting. What part is it that is actually failing? Is it a bearing in the clutch assy of in the engine case that holds the shaft?

If anyone can shed any light and share what they know, that would be appreciated.

[homey]

that's a dry bearing not much different then the wheels turn on isn't it?

[Mel46]

I would have to have my mechanic explain it to me, but I know it has something to do with a collar, a 29 mm bearing and another bearing. I know that when Dave and I took the bike apart as far as we went was to pull out everything that was visible after pulling the cover off, and we still did not reach the area where the problem was. The stuff under the cover included the variator and clutch assembly, so somewhere around that shaft that sticks through and the clutch attaches to, the bearings (multiple from what the mechanic is telling me) got chewed up. I am not a mechanic so I do not know the exact wording, but both mechanics that have been assigned to it said that it would not have made it another 10 miles. Now the little pcx that could has been sitting in the shop for over a month while the parts are back ordered at Honda in Japan. My wife is very upset because we ride together or not at all, so no riding till it gets fixed, unless we can find another set of wheels during the wait. Fat chance of that happening.

[ScooterMan]

Mel, if you can keep us updated on the cost, or if you have an extended warranty, what it would have cost to fix when it all gets done.

[iceman]

I wonder if the 2015's have this problem fixed.

[sendler2112]

13,000 miles ridden through rain and salty slush on my 2013 PCX150 and no problems of any kind yet.

[Tom192]

13,500 for me on a 13 plate no issues whatsoever

[Mel46]

I hope that it is a fluke and not something every PCX owner has to worry about. We still have mine worry about, which has less miles than my wife's does but is the same exact model. I am glad we purchased the extended warranty on hers, but wouldn't you know it, we didn't buy one on mine. One dealer has already charged $500 against that warranty, but I think they just serviced it, which was covered. They kept telling me that it sounded great and ran fine. Well, it didn't sound good or run good. Hopefully the parts will all come in soon. The mechanic is calling all over the country for them. Several are on their way from out of state now. Maybe it will be fixed soon. Maybe we will be able to get back to riding. Maybe sooooon!!

[Mel46]

Well we just heard from the shop on our bike. They got all the parts in and put the bike back together but the problem is still there. So, they are now on the phone with Honda. They uploaded a video to them and are discusding what to do. The shop thinks it has a manufacturing defect. Keep in mind that Honda is picking up the tab on this, so it isn't like someone wants to make more money by holding the bike for no reason. Now there are 3 mechanics in the shop who are involved, plus Honda. I will keep everyone informed as to what Honda says.

[SECoda]

That is pretty wild. I have owned maybe seven "craft" of various types over the years that I can remember with CVT's and repaired the clutches/bearings on two of them. (One snowmobile and one ATV - both Polaris). The Polaris are a bit tricky too and expensive to fix the unit unless just the belt is worn. What were the symptoms it had? DOA or did it still lope along? Make any bearing noise or smell? The PCX sounds even more complex.

[Mel46]

The sound we noticed first were like someone had thrown a hand full of bolts into the cvt area. It got worse as time and milage went by, and eventually the rpm stayed up but speed wasn't. Then it added some burning smell to the mix. Eventually we brought it in to a dealer. They serviced it and declared it all fixed. We rode it out of there shaking our heads. We rode it another 10 miles before deciding to take it to another dealer. Since we had used the current dealer & repair shop multiple times since purchasing our scooters, we brought it to them. They listened to it and shook their heads. Then two of the mechanics rode my bike and then hers and immediately advised us not to ride it any more until they at least took it apart to see what was making such a loud racket. After tearing it down they called us to tell us that the bearings had been chewed up in the area that we riders might consider the transmission. Now that those parts have been replaced and the sound is still there, the mechanics are worried that there is a defect in the internal parts that are causing the bearings etc to go bad. No additional information, other than them sending a video to Honda and the shop and Honda talking some more.

So that is how things are at the moment. HONDA has the ball now.

[SECoda]

I like this video of the PCX CVT. A guy is replacing the variator. It's the only thing we have good access to w/o much disassembly. I wonder if the bearings behind the CVT have gone out maybe at this point rather than the CVT? Let us know.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-awtE8S3oPs

[you you]

I like this video of the PCX CVT. A guy is replacing the variator. It's the only thing we have good access to w/o much disassembly. I wonder if the bearings behind the CVT have gone out maybe at this point rather than the CVT? Let us know.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-awtE8S3oPs

Aren't the bearings behind the variator the main crank bearings?

[SECoda]

Yup. With the dealer with a significant service staff going back to Honda it has to be more significant than just the CVT is my guess. I suspect Honda wants a video since the warranty bill could get significant now. A entire new powertrain would be cool (for free) but a rebuild may be more likely. As far as I can tell from research this is pretty rare on a Honda. More common on my Polaris ATV.

[ScooterMan]

At ths point Mel46, you may want to check your state's "lemon law." In CA, if the bike in in the shop for 30 or more days for warrantable repairs in the first 18 mo or 18k miles, it's a "lemon."

[Mel46]

Good news! Our little pcx came home today. Finally!! They haven't put together the total cost of repairing it yet, but they allowed us to take it home. They have to put a claim in against the extended warranty still.
So here is what they found, in a nutshell. There were bad bearings involved, some blame of which could go to dirt and grit getting into the grease. There were problems with 2 bad springs, installed wrong i think they said. Then there were several bearing collars that were torn up when the bearings failed. Hmmm, let me see if I missed anything. Oh, and there was a lot of grit and dirt from brake dust, belt dust, and other dirt. How did it get there? It seems that there is an open area in there somewhere, and other manufacturers require it to be cleaned and inspected ever so often. Honda does not. Sooo, it is hit or miss as to whether dirt can get in there. Now I am not a mechanic, so don't ask me where all of this is until I get the detailed report. Until then just know that the clutch, bearings, springs, etc. are in danger of getting crud into them on this scooter. Most riders will luck out and have no problems. Others will just get unlucky like us and get stuff inside. I know, this doesn't make sense. Sorry. I can't give you more info. I hope someone else here can. What is open around the clutch area that can allow grit to get into the bearings behind that casing? Is there a hole there?

[SECoda]

I would sure like to know which bearings were involved. Thanks for the update.

[Mel46]

The only thing that I can say for sure on one of the bearing assemblies is that it was an odd size so they couldn't get it locally. He showed it to me and it started with 20x29...something. He said that had it been a 20x30 he could have gotten one at a local Autozone, but the 29 threw them. I have been looking through the service manual and can't find it yet. I have been looking in the book around the Finsl Reduction area. Ok, I just now looked at a partial parts list they provided us. It does not have that bearing assembly, BUT the document says "Bearing failure in Driven Clutch" as one of the problems. It says they replaced the clutch inner bearings in the driven clutch. Like I said, that was but one of the problems. I hope this helps.

[buddy1976]

I would sure like to know which bearings were involved. Thanks for the update.

this is the part i have ordered http://www.gearhead.com/honda-23205-kwn ... -KWN-640/1 it is the complete unit with all the bearings fitted. this item is on back order so who knows when it will arrive. i will post to confirm this has solved my problem or not.

[Mel46]

Wow! Thanks for the link. I think they rebuilt mine because the part was on backorder, if this is the same area. Like I said, I'm not a mechanic, so I can't tell you more than I did. However, keep in mind that the scooter was in the shop for 7 or 8 weeks because of backordered parts. They finally took matters into their own hands and started calling every Honda dealer in America to get the parts they needed. They went so much above and beyond that we bought the whole group pizzas and tea. I really hope that part fixes your problem, and I really, really hope that part comes off of backorder for you. I noticed that it fits multiple manufacturer's models. I'm also surprised that it even fits a Suzuki Burgman 650.