The Honda PCX / Forza / ADV150 / SH Forums

PCX-rider wrote:I am not agree that the fuel saved is negligible.

Fair enough, but here's a story which might enhance your understanding.
Linky

gn2 wrote:

PCX-rider wrote:I am not agree that the fuel saved is negligible.

Fair enough, but here's a story which might enhance your understanding.
Linky

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I do think you underestimate the impact of idle stop system. If you only look at a single motorcykle (scooter), the CO2 reduction may be small compared to a PCX without the idle stop system. But I think you have to look worldwide and be aware of the numbers of sold vehicles I`ve read the article about the test you linked. Based on the information in the test, I made ​​a calculation to demonstrate the impact of idle stop system for a large number of PCX`s.

Assumptions:
• Emissions from the combustion of gasoline is 2.32 kg CO2 per liter of petrol.
• Average mileage : 4000 km/year
• 10 000 Honda PCX sold worldwide

CO2 emissions of a motorcykle or car is measured in grams per kilometer. Emissions of greenhouse gases depends on consumption. Consumption in liters multiplied by the emission factor, divided by the distance traveled. To get the grams you finally multiply with thousand.
Without Stop and Go:
4.17 x 2.32 liter / 143.4 x1000 = 67.46 grams per kilometer x 4000 km/1000 = 269.84 kg per year
With Stop and Go:
4.01 x 2.32 liter / 143.4 x1000 = 64.87 grams per kilometer x 4000km/1000 = 259.48 kg per year

Saved CO2 : 10.36 kg per year x 10 000 = 103.600 kilogram (or 103 tonn)

If you still think idle stop system is not effective against pollution, so help me GOD!

PCX-rider wrote:If you still think idle stop system is not effective against pollution, so help me GOD!

I made no comment about the pollution reduction of the PCX idle-stop system, but I will now: I can honestly say I don't care a flying fuck about it.
All I care about is how much cash the fuel costs me and how much cash is saved by idle-stop.
And that saving is negligible.

PCX-rider wrote:

gn2 wrote:

PCX-rider wrote:I am not agree that the fuel saved is negligible.

Fair enough, but here's a story which might enhance your understanding.
Linky

..................................................................................................................................................................................
I do think you underestimate the impact of idle stop system. If you only look at a single motorcykle (scooter), the CO2 reduction may be small compared to a PCX without the idle stop system. But I think you have to look worldwide and be aware of the numbers of sold vehicles I`ve read the article about the test you linked. Based on the information in the test, I made ​​a calculation to demonstrate the impact of idle stop system for a large number of PCX`s.

Assumptions:
• Emissions from the combustion of gasoline is 2.32 kg CO2 per liter of petrol.
• Average mileage : 4000 km/year
• 10 000 Honda PCX sold worldwide

CO2 emissions of a motorcykle or car is measured in grams per kilometer. Emissions of greenhouse gases depends on consumption. Consumption in liters multiplied by the emission factor, divided by the distance traveled. To get the grams you finally multiply with thousand.
Without Stop and Go:
4.17 x 2.32 liter / 143.4 x1000 = 67.46 grams per kilometer x 4000 km/1000 = 269.84 kg per year
With Stop and Go:
4.01 x 2.32 liter / 143.4 x1000 = 64.87 grams per kilometer x 4000km/1000 = 259.48 kg per year

Saved CO2 : 10.36 kg per year x 10 000 = 103.600 kilogram (or 103 tonn)

If you still think idle stop system is not effective against pollution, so help me GOD!

Is this another joke?

PCX-rider wrote:...Assumptions:

• Emissions from the combustion of gasoline is 2.32 kg CO2 per liter of petrol.
• Average mileage : 4000 km/year
...

I´m riding ~1000km/month with my scooter

gn2 wrote:

PCX-rider wrote:If you still think idle stop system is not effective against pollution, so help me GOD!

I made no comment about the pollution reduction of the PCX idle-stop system, but I will now: I can honestly say I don't care a flying fuck about it.
All I care about is how much cash the fuel costs me and how much cash is saved by idle-stop.
And that saving is negligible.

But I made comment about saving fuel and environment: "I am not agree that the fuel saved is negligible. PCX is designed as a city bike. Many of the main traffic lights in my city last for 60 seconds (there is a count down display) and many last for 30 seconds before swithing from red to green. I pass these traffic lights several times a day, and usually I have to wait for the light to switch. As the engine stop running after 3 seconds while I am waiting, there is no use of fuel at the waiting time. Ergo: saved fuel! During a year or the lifetime of this nice scooter, I am convinced there is a great potential of saving fuel, environment and money for the owner. That`s why I think Honda`s profilation of this bike meets many requirements of future buyers."
...................................................................................................................................................................................

According to my example: using the idle stop system reduces CO2 pollution, then it`s easy to understand that we also save fuel (cash).

Ged wrote:
Is this another joke?[/quote]

Isn`t life a joke?

Ishida wrote:

PCX-rider wrote:...Assumptions:

• Emissions from the combustion of gasoline is 2.32 kg CO2 per liter of petrol.
• Average mileage : 4000 km/year
...

I´m riding ~1000km/month with my scooter

Average mileage : 4000 km a year my friend! These data was taken from GN2`s link.

10.36kg is nothing.

You yourself, your body, in just breathing normally, emits about a kg of CO2 a day. In a year, you're using 3x more than the CO2 savings from having idle fuel stop. Now consider how many humans there are vs how many PCXes... See how insignificant the figure is, even assuming every PCX is equipped with idle stop?

Or how about this... A dairy cow emits more than 11 times the CO2 a human does, over 33x more than idle stop per year. That's not even considering the massive amount of methane that the cow produces, which is actually bad for the atmosphere. If you want to protect the environment, don't eat beef. Seriously. But that's crazy, beef is delicious. I certainly eat a lot of beef.

CO2 is actually not really that bad. We hardly affect the overall CO2 output of the earth as humans. Global warming comes as a result of other gases mostly.

maddiedog wrote:Or how about this... A dairy cow emits more than 11 times the CO2 a human does, over 33x more than idle stop per year. That's not even considering the massive amount of methane that the cow produces, which is actually bad for the atmosphere. If you want to protect the environment, don't eat beef. Seriously. But that's crazy, beef is delicious. I certainly eat a lot of beef.

Given the dietary requirements of a small to medium sized dog the average family would reduce their co2 production more by killing the family pet than getting rid of their Range Rover.

But the ecobabblers are all talking bollocks anyway.
Human impact on the ecosystem is minimal.

If everyone who reads this message holds their breath for 10 seconds we will have reduced CO2 emissions enough to cancel out the effects of all the PCXs sold without idle stop. LOL

I’m reducing CO2 by riding a PCX. Can you imagine how much more breathing I’d do if I had to ride a bicycle everywhere???

maddiedog wrote:10.36kg is nothing.

I bought my PCX because of low consumption and good skills in the citytraffic. My Honda dealer told me I can save approximately 7% or more fuel by using the idle stop system. And I belived him, because Honda worldwide mention the same in their info about PCX. http://world.honda.com/motorcycle-pictu ... ling-stop/ And scientific experiments with start and go system shows you can save 18 percent fuel more ore less with a well working system. http://mate.tue.nl/mate/pdfs/6896.pdf

I`m no environmentalist, but I do care a little about the environment. And according to my thinking 10.36 kilogram is absolutely more than nothing. In fact it is 10 times more than nothing (zero).

And how many PCX`s are sold worldwide? I don`t know, but an estimate can be 100.000? And if 50 % is sold with idle stop system, we get a huge number of vehiles saving fuel (and money). Is 10.36 kilogram each bike a year still nothing? 10.36kg x 50.000 = 518000 kg or 518 tons. I don`t think so!

So how does the PCX150 affect the environment?

PCX-rider wrote:I`m no environmentalist, but I do care a little about the environment. And according to my thinking 10.36 kilogram is absolutely more than nothing. In fact it is 10 times more than nothing (zero).

Not an environmentalist eh?
Looks very much like you're no mathematician either...

gn2 wrote:

PCX-rider wrote:I`m no environmentalist, but I do care a little about the environment. And according to my thinking 10.36 kilogram is absolutely more than nothing. In fact it is 10 times more than nothing (zero).

Not an environmentalist eh?
Looks very much like you're no mathematician either...

Lol i thought this very thing. 10x0=?

If you would like to save the environment further, theres a few options.

1. Cng, or compressed natural gas.
2. Ethanol, renewable fuel with extremely low emissions
3. Non motorized transportation.

If any of these are considerable factors, i hope your house is off the grid using solar or wind energy, as the energy created to power your house in most situations is far more threatening to the environment.

Also there are electric motorcycles, we can buy these http://www.zeromotorcycles.com/street/ here and as all our states electricity is from hydro that would be green (apart from battery construction and disposal). The things that concern me are battery longevity & price and high depreciation due to evolving technology.

The Zeros are really cool -- the local shop near me carries them. They don't allow test rides unfortunately, otherwise I would have at least tried it out.

Urbanian wrote:I’m reducing CO2 by riding a PCX. Can you imagine how much more breathing I’d do if I had to ride a bicycle everywhere???

Perhaps if you include you breathing whilst on the PCX.... maybe not. Not to forget the long term health benefits of exercising etc etc.

Honestly, if you like using it, use it. If you don't, then don't. I don't for the simple fact that I don't want my battery to be changed over quicker than I need it to be as well as the fact that once I have HID installed, I'd either have to run the bike without low beams and use idle stop or lights on and no idle stop. I do love the idle stop so that I don't have a personal vibrator between my legs when I stop at the lights. The feeling of nothingness is great but if the batteries could handle the constant start-stop needs, then for sure I'd use it.