Two 2014 Forzas at my dealer

[SECoda]

I test drove a Forza again this morning at my local dealer. He has two red 2014s that just won't move (no ABS). He let me know he will discount them heavily at this point. With the annual bonus just around I told him I may pick up one if he discounts it enough. It would be no destination charge and under $5000 US. I told him if he will go $4500 plus just the registration fee I will reserve it. I plan on keeping both bikes. The PCX 150 is perfect for local touring and camping.

What do you Forza owners think? They are new but with a few test rides on them (like me).

[kcpcx]

A local dealer north of Kansas City is advertising a new Forza, non ABS, for $4799.

When I bought my PCX, one of the dealers was pretty up front about how they can discount something as low margin as a scooter. Basically Honda will have a rebate to the dealer, and they sometimes have some flexible rebate cash from Honda as well. It sounded to me like the money was in a pool for them to use. The pool had a finite amount of money in it, and each dealer had their own little pool. Some of the dealers where I shopped for my PCX told me they had already exhausted their rebate pool money for the month, and until the next month, they could not access the funds. Hence they could not meet my price on the scooter.

This jives with how the car business worked when I sold and managed at a VW store.


I shopped pretty aggressively over the phone for my PCX, and visited 3 or 4 dealers in person here in KC. Called the whole way to Topeka, KS, Wichita, KS, Jeff City MO, Joplin, and Pittsburg KS. Probably 150 mile radius of KC, trying to find not only a red PCX but a steal on a red PCX. It gave me a pretty good feel for what dealers wanted to deal and who did not, at least in the western half of Missouri.

The lowest price dealer I found around Kansas City, by far, was the Honda dealer in St. Joseph, MO, about 45 min or an hour north of KC on I-29. They hit me with the lowest price, right up front, no BS. I ended up buying closer to my house because I got close on price here, and driving to St Joe and hauling the scoot back would cost me half in gas what I saved going up there, not including my time and not wanting to go to the trouble to haul the PCX home. But on price alone, St Joe Honda was the best, immediately, no haggle.


They have a Forza that I have the hots for for $4799. In my opinion, if they are advertising that machine for $4799, that is probably about as low as you can get one for in Missouri. I may be proven wrong by you if you get yours for less. But my gut feeling is that $4799 is probably a zero deal for them. Nobody probably rides a scooter up there in St Joe, and they probably want rid of the thing at close to break even.

Anyway, thought I'd post this in case it helped you since you're fairly "local" to me. I'd really rather you didn't get a Forza, because that would make me want one even more, and I really don't need a third cycle in the garage. Plus, I'd be green with envy, that whole thing.

https://kansascity.craigslist.org/mcd/4666311881.html

[you you]

A local dealer north of Kansas City is advertising a new Forza, non ABS, for $4799.

When I bought my PCX, one of the dealers was pretty up front about how they can discount something as low margin as a scooter. Basically Honda will have a rebate to the dealer, and they sometimes have some flexible rebate cash from Honda as well. It sounded to me like the money was in a pool for them to use. The pool had a finite amount of money in it, and each dealer had their own little pool. Some of the dealers where I shopped for my PCX told me they had already exhausted their rebate pool money for the month, and until the next month, they could not access the funds. Hence they could not meet my price on the scooter.

This jives with how the car business worked when I sold and managed at a VW store.


I shopped pretty aggressively over the phone for my PCX, and visited 3 or 4 dealers in person here in KC. Called the whole way to Topeka, KS, Wichita, KS, Jeff City MO, Joplin, and Pittsburg KS. Probably 150 mile radius of KC, trying to find not only a red PCX but a steal on a red PCX. It gave me a pretty good feel for what dealers wanted to deal and who did not, at least in the western half of Missouri.

The lowest price dealer I found around Kansas City, by far, was the Honda dealer in St. Joseph, MO, about 45 min or an hour north of KC on I-29. They hit me with the lowest price, right up front, no BS. I ended up buying closer to my house because I got close on price here, and driving to St Joe and hauling the scoot back would cost me half in gas what I saved going up there, not including my time and not wanting to go to the trouble to haul the PCX home. But on price alone, St Joe Honda was the best, immediately, no haggle.


They have a Forza that I have the hots for for $4799. In my opinion, if they are advertising that machine for $4799, that is probably about as low as you can get one for in Missouri. I may be proven wrong by you if you get yours for less. But my gut feeling is that $4799 is probably a zero deal for them. Nobody probably rides a scooter up there in St Joe, and they probably want rid of the thing at close to break even.

Anyway, thought I'd post this in case it helped you since you're fairly "local" to me. I'd really rather you didn't get a Forza, because that would make me want one even more, and I really don't need a third cycle in the garage. Plus, I'd be green with envy, that whole thing.

https://kansascity.craigslist.org/mcd/4666311881.html

Have you factored your time and effort into the overall price?

[kcpcx]

Yes, hence why I bought closer to my house compared with going to St Joe to buy for $200 less.

My total time on the phone was less than an hour. Probably 30 or 40 min. I only spent time going to a few dealers to attempt to see a red one in person.

The main reason I had to call all over creation was not price. It was color. Every dealer seemed to have 2013s left in black, and only a few in red. So the first goal was to nail down who had a red PCX. Then once I got down to that small list, see if they could meet the price I wanted to buy at.

I could have had black for a couple hundred less, if I was willing to travel. The extra money, at the time, seemed worth it for the color I wanted and the lack of travel hassle. If I had found a black one close to my house that was $200 cheaper, I probably would have gone black. But to save the money, it involved settling on color AND taking 3 hours out of my day and gasoline expense for in inefficient truck. Not worth it.

[SECoda]

Is that $4799 w/o the destination fee? They still has that on the tag (about $500) but said he would not include it.

[kcpcx]

Not sure.

When I talked to them about a PCX, I got the vibe that there were no fees or crap tacked on up there. The sales manager was totally not what you normally run into, not a wheeler dealer type. Very straightforward.

Contrast that to the huge mega line powersports dealer here in Grandview near me. It's like an old school car dealership in that place. Multiple runs back and forth to the manager for numbers, blah blah. Forget it. Of course, they had two red ones in stock. Fortunately I found another dealer here in KC who had red but was $200 higher than St Joe. I couldn't get anyone below $2800 out the door here in Kansas City or Columbia area.

I'd wager there is a good chance you could get that one in St Joe for $4800 delivered, exclusive of taxes of course. Maybe give them a call and ask if that's out the door. I bet they really don't want a Forza on the floor in St Joe all winter. It's just not a scooter kind of town. They probably sell a ton of ATVs and one scooter a year. They probably close down and go out for beers when they get a Forza or PCX off the floor up there.

I just looked at their website. I believe I talked to Jason, the GM, on the phone. Makes sense, as he didn't have to play the let me ask my manager game everyone else did when I inquired.

I looked at their Facebook page. In some of the thanks for your business pics of people getting new bikes, you can see that Forza in the background. lol

[SECoda]

Delivered might be hard to beat. My son lives north of Columbia, Mo so I could have him pick it up with a trailer. He said St. Joe is about 2.5 hrs. I am about the same distance from him and would trailer it home if need be. My wife makes me pay cash for my toys so that helps the negotiation sometimes.

[kcpcx]

Yeah, that sounds about right from Columbia to St Joe.

If it was a bigger motorcycle, I'd say jump on Amtrak in STL, ride to my place in Lees Summit, and I could give you a ride to St Joe pretty easy to pick up, then you ride it home. But you wouldn't want to ride a brand new Forza home that far, probably, for break in reasons.

I live 2 or 3 miles from the little Amtrak station in LS.

[SECoda]

I go prairie dog hunting in North Dakota every May and drive up through there on the 1000 mile trek to Fort Yates, ND. On the way home this year we only made it to St. Joe and spent the night. My wife goes but stays back at the casino while we hunt.

[kcpcx]

Nice.

Well, in the remote event you need any help getting up there to get it, let me know. It wouldn't be a problem, most likely, during the week. I work weekends so often have mid-week free.

[SECoda]

Thanks a lot. Hopefully, I can work the local guy down. I bought my PCX at the Honda in Nashville, IL south of Carlyle Lake because they were the only one with a red 2013 left in the area and willing to deal and no destination fee.

The dealer with the two Forza's also has two 2015 PCX's now. One white and one black. I know with winter and 2015 coming quickly they are under the gun to get rid of the 2014's. They also have a used Yamaha Majesty 300 (now the 400), two used Silver Wings and a few other used scooters. They are out of the Ruckus which are on order but they know scooters well for service and their reputation is decent with the new manager they have had the last five years or so.

[gn2]

I think that you should sell the PCX and get a Forza with ABS.

[SECoda]

I have not seen the ABS anywhere in the area within 50 miles. I'll check inventory for several hundred miles. They may be unavailable for now here.

[SECoda]

A nearby dealer (25 miles) has one. Lets see what they might deal.

[SECoda]

Turns out that is the largest scooter dealer near St. louis and i missed it on earlier searches. It has 38 scooters in inventory. . I need to get up there.

[SECoda]

As it turns out the giant dealer in town I went to yesterday also has giant prices. They were very busy for a Sunday even though they can't sell anything because the banks are not open. They wanted $3750 for my red 2013 PCX 150 for example but everything I looked at was a few hundred worse than my local dealer after destination. They also have most Honda OEM parts in stock. Besides Honda, they do Indian, Yamaha, Suzuki, Harley, KTM, Star, Can-Am, See-Doo, and a few others. They may be too big to deal with IMO. They have three buildings plus a warehouse with over 1000 different units in inventory.

Back to Forza.

The common complaint I hear on the Forza and Burgman is there is leg length limitation. I am about 5' 11" and my short test rides seemed fine but I wonder on longer rides if you get cramped in the postition. I guess the only way to fix it is also a seat replacement? (which are expensive relative to a PCX)

[kcpcx]

There is a pretty large cycle dealer near me here in KC. Probably the biggest one in the city unless there is another I'm unaware of. Multiple bike lines, huge indoor showroom with a bazillion bikes on display...

...they are also the highest priced place, from what I can tell. More high pressure, with a lot of salespeople who follow you around constantly if you're browsing.

Every time I set foot in that place, which is a couple times a year to see what is out there cycle wise in the world, I can't believe they are still in business. It's the least pleasant place to actually buy a bike in the world. Total stereotypical car dealership vibe. It's really off-putting.

I guess having a lot of inventory on hand sells bikes. The other stores around here have half the bikes on the floor but are light years more pleasant to deal with. I gave them first shot at me when I bought the PCX, and they ended up being the highest on price.

I need to find a Forza on the ground around here and go sit on it and get my head around the pros and cons of the design. I see super clean, used Majesties (400) come up for sale around here for $2500 or less fairly often. Also real clean Helixes (250) if you keep an eye out for around 2 grand. At that point, I ask myself if a Forza is worth twice the price of a super clean low miles used Majesty or Helix. Perhaps not. Need to see a Forza more up close.

I'd consider a People 300 but you never see those for sale around Kansas City, and the one new Kymco dealer has insane prices on the tags on the scoots. His Kymcos must run on printer ink cartridges or something.

[SECoda]

My buddy bought his Majesty 400 used and saved a bunch (he is 6'2" and wanted one he would be comfortable on) from a private party at some distance. New the Burgman and Majesty are quite a bit more than the Forza and I think they look a bit better not to mention the performance difference. The Majesty had the best comfort size wise and there was no snug feeling like the others. I have not found any good used deals at the dealers. Even the Kymco Downtown 300i has more features than the Forza for about the same price. Both are in that 25 HP range and advertise 68-69 mpg. The Kymco only weighs 367 lbs. vs. the Forza 422 lbs. w/o ABS. St. Louis Power Sports is a Yamaha, Suzuki, Polaris, Can-Am, Kymco dealer that is very close to me as well. Of the bunch and I have ridden all of them the Majesty is king IMO (pun intended) but it would take a used one to get in the range I am willing to pay. It is smooth, roomy, well built, and relatively powerful. It appears the Forza fuel pump recall will get fixed on the two 2014s at my Honda dealership before I get a stab at them.

I forgot to mention my local Honda salesman said the PCX outsold the Forza six to one at their location so far this year and they always had at least one of each in stock.

[Vesper2112]

I don't know... I'm 5'11" and do a 30 minute ride to work every morning (and 30 min home in the afternoon) and I'm perfectly comfortable with the leg space. With that said, I don't really have much to compare it to, so I may have just conditioned myself that "it is what it is". Still, I've been riding for about 2 months solid on the Forza and haven't had leg room be an issue for me yet.

[kcpcx]

I wonder what percentage of Forzas sold in the USA are ABS bikes...