Might Have to Say "Goodbye" to My Buddy

[Wingscribe]

Hello all,

Long-time lurker, first-time poster.

I caught the scooter bug last winter, and picked up a (used) clean Genuine Buddy last spring. I had no idea if this thing was going to sit and gather dust in the garage, or what?

Well, after the MSF class, "M" Endorsement, I just turned 4000 miles since May...

I guess you could say that scootering has stuck.

Now that I my first "season" of riding under my belt, I am starting to think about something different...I will ways love my little Buddy 150, but being 6 foot, 230, it is a rather small machine. It has performed flawlessly, but I would appreciate a bit more room and closer dealer support.

Can't swing a dead cat without hitting a Honda dealer - there are three within 10 miles of my house.

When I was originally looking for a scoot to call my own, I looked long and hard at the PCX, but there was nothing used in my area (and I wanted something used, if the aforementioned gathering dust happened) and right next to the PCX was the Forza.

"I'd never want anything that big..." I told myself, and dismissed the 300ccs of red.

After five months of WoT doing 55-60 on the Buddy, I think I might want something that big...

So, in the coming weeks, I will do a back-to-back comparison of the two, with the intention of buying one. My only powered two-wheel experience has been on that Buddy, and I have no frame of reference for what the rest of the scoot universe has to offer.

Right now, I am leaning towards the Forza...being able to go on the highway would be a nice option (I know, I know, the PCX can do it - so can the Buddy, but I don't have the courage).

So, that's where I am right now. Already have a plan for reworking the Forza seat-back, if I head that way, and there seems no shortage of top cases for either - Windshields either.

If anyone has any thoughts, I'd love to hear them - I'll all you nice folk in the know as we get close to the zero hour,

Mike

[tbln930]

Well I bought a Forza second while still keeping the PCX and it was great for a while. Then I bought Suzuki V-Strom and it does it all very very well. Now the Forza is for sale.

[Brent]

My experience on my stock 2015 PCX 150:

4,841 miles since March, 2015.
96mpg - 102mpg average (I live at 3,000 feet elevation and in a hilly region)
Top speed was 68pmh when I first bought the PCX 150 6 months ago. Now top speed is 63mph.
I am 5' 11" and 270lbs. Above 50mph and climbing a hill I am full throttle.
The seat has a valley that your butt sits in. I wish the seat was flat so I could sit back further.

Pretty happy so far!

[dasshreddar]

Welcome well you posted in the forza section so i assume you are leaning towards the forza
If you want any sort of power above 55mph i think the forza is a much better choice.
The pcx wont give you much more than the buddy...
Is weight a factor?
Even with my "forza" over 100lbs lighter than stock..., i miss the 230lbs of my "pcx",
all that being said power is starting out weigh weight for me 500cc+ anyone....(tmax???)

[dergav]

Mike
I was in a very similar position to you a number of years back and bought a used Honda SWing 125cc( a european scooter)...private deal... for a bit of fun as it had been over 40 years since last on a motorbike...It was just great and I could not imagine ever changing it. However the Honda dealer 14 months ago ( while I was wandering around the showroom) made me an offer I could not refuse against the Forza ...offered me for the SWing almost what I had paid for it 3.5 years earlier !..so I changed. I now cannot imagine being without the Forza as it is just so much better than my SWing ( which was a great bike). I feel much more secure on the Forza and like you was uncertain about Motorway travel on the SWing ...but no such inhibitions on the Forza...but the years on the SWing had given me confidence. My experience of different bikes is very limited but if any are better than the Forza then they need to be very good. I am 5ft 10 ins and "slightly" overweight and the Forza fits me perfectly as it is and have done over 5000 mls in 12 months and on every road style. Honda dealers being near you will be a factor in any decision.
Apart from the fuel pump being changed( I hadnt had any problem) I have ( to date and fingers crossed!) had none of the issues some others have mentioned.
Good luck with your choice/decision and hope my comments contribute to your knowledge.

[fish]

Dear fellow Ohio scooter rider!!!
3 Honda dealers within late cat swinging here, too.
I owned the Forza for exactly 365 days, after a 163cc kymco.
Here's my sincere thinking....either get a great deal on a low mileage Forza, or shop a bazillion dealers online within 200 miles for left over scooters. Fall coming on here...buyers market. Forza is a great scooter, if overpriced MSP, see used prices and how fast it loses value..
Shop 250, 300, 325, 350 cc scooters. Kymco, BV350, SYM. ALL will give good daily use without massive servicing needs. Do the oil and filters yourself.
PCX is too small a step from your Buddy...you'll regret spending so much for so little six mos from now. New Forza at list is too pricey....I bought a new leftover 400 Burgman for same price! Look for internet special prices...get 2 or 3 dealers bidding for your $ on similar scoots (forza vs bv350, etc.) . I bought via internet, scoot was delivered 97 miles to my driveway. Phone snd Dell are the best shopping tools!! Get them on the phone and work them, once you've narrowed your choices.
Take your time, expand your thinking...that piaggio bv 350 is a killer scoot and just sitting in ohio dealers for low prices (check new carlisle vespa dealer for examples)
A superb (read reviews) Kymco PEOPLE 250 with 10 miles on clock at $2999 and he will deal on that price.
I love Hondas too....but Forza isn't perfect (oil/coolant leak, fuel pump) and several just as good for less $ and equal or better servicing needs.
PM me if you want more...
Good luck.
Fish

[Wingscribe]

Thanks for the comments, everyone.

Tbln: Sorry to hear that you are selling the Forza, but understand the issue - with the PCX and the V-Strom, the Forza looks like the the forgotten middle child.

Brent: Flat Seat - yes! The buddy has one and I love the options of sliding forward and back, depending on what my aching shoulders are telling me (I would really consider the Smax (is that a dirty word around here?) if they had the seat from the Zuma on it. I get it, it's all about getting more space under the seat, but I'll happily add a top case to better care for my copious rear end...

Dash: Weight? Absolutely it is a factor. I weight less than the Buddy before dinner, about the same after...the difference between it and the PCX is only 50 pounds, which is not that much, but the extra 200 to move up to a Forza? I must say I am a little intimidated, but that is what the test drive is for. If I can't handle the thing in the parking lot, then I know it was not meant to be. And I LOVE the TMax...sitting on that pig makes me feel that bike was made just for me, but sticker shock is a powerful thing, and hitting five figures is more than I can handle at the moment.

Dergav: Gotta love the concept of "free" transportation, especially when moving up the food chain aftwewards.

It all depends on what I want to be when I grow up (motorcycle wise...will always be a 42-year-old man child in the flesh). If I want to keep riding the way I am, the PCX will fit the bill nicely, a little better MPG and MPH, much more refinement.

If I want more...there is the Forza...

I made a promise to the wife that I would not even take a test ride until October (this was months ago, but I am sticking to it), so I guess we have at least six days to get some more information, something not off a spec sheet or online review.

I have never been a patient man, but I will muddle through.

Thanks for the replies everyone...I'll keep you up to date,

Mike

[Wingscribe]

Fish, I think I just missed you in the electrons...

*EDIT* And happy scooter anniversary *EDIT*

I have done a considerable amount of research before getting the Buddy this past spring, drove my kids nuts heading to dealers all over the Cincinnati-Dayton corridor. I never dd make it all the way up to New Carlyle, but have heard good things about them from my local scooter club (Mighty Oooo!) - I might take a trip up there in the coming days - thanks!

BV350? Yeah, that is a nice one, similar style to the People and SH150 (local dealer had one used, and I was excited, but the riding position was a no-go for me). I sat on the old model (with the PCX-esque) hump, and did not care for it too much, but the hump is not gone...might be worth a second look.

I do plan to hit up multiple dealers when I decide what it is that I want...

Honda as a brand makes the most sense to me in there here and now...they make things easy and take a lot of the worry out of the after-purchase (parts availability and the like).

If I get the Forza, I'll start bringing out my DSLR in the pre-dawn hours...give you a little competition (haha).

Thanks for input, I'll try to find some time in the busy schedule to head up north...(My daughter is cheering in Carlyle this weekend, that the same as New Carlyle...right???),

Mike

[tbln930]

Here is the latest motorcycle reliability summary. Yamaha/Suzuki/Honda lead the charge.
http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/news ... ethod=auto

[Wingscribe]

Interesting read. I can't say I was too surprised about the top three, but I had no idea there were so many issues with Can Am products - granted, I know nothing about them, but I see more of them around here than fellow scooterists.

I'm taking a trip up to the north side of Dayton tomorrow to plant my backside on some Piaggios, Kymcos, and Vespas (Oh My!).

I will regale you with the story of my adventures, which will be less sitting on scoots and more saying to my kids "I said not to touch ANYTHING!"

Thanks for the link,

Mike

[tbln930]

We torture the BMW GS bike guys on my V-Strom forum with those statistics who try to tell us how much better their $16-20k BMW bikes are vs our $6-12k Suzuki's .

[WaunaPCX]

The seat has a valley that your butt sits in. I wish the seat was flat so I could sit back further.

Sounds like this might help: https://bikerzbits.com/honda-pcx-custom-seat-4127.html



$58.23 + shipping.

[fish]

Interesting read. I can't say I was too surprised about the top three, but I had no idea there were so many issues with Can Am products - granted, I know nothing about them, but I see more of them around here than fellow scooterists.

I'm taking a trip up to the north side of Dayton tomorrow to plant my backside on some Piaggios, Kymcos, and Vespas (Oh My!).

I will regale you with the story of my adventures, which will be less sitting on scoots and more saying to my kids "I said not to touch ANYTHING!"

Thanks for the link,

Mike

There is a Vespa dealer in California, video on youtube for the BV350. He has a lot of good to say about it, similar shape to your Buddy.
He makes a seemingly good point about not letting that seat bump keep you from owning a great scooter. "Take it off!", he says.
I shopped the BV in New Carlisle.....beautiful scooter in the classic style.
Went with the Forza though, since I always wanted a RED scooter!
Some Kymcos in Springfield....but they don't deal much. Might have some leftover Kymco 300, or a new old stock Burgman 400.
I bought from Mid-Ohio in Mt. Vernon, good folks. Delivered. Whole deal was internet and phone.
Great coffee shops here in Yellow Springs,(Underdog Cafe, Dino's, Energetic Goat :-))
scooter friendly.....heck, they like all weirdos!
Good hunting!
Fish

[Wingscribe]

Wauna, if only they made a replacement seat like that for the Forza...Amazingly, I am okay with the stock seat on the (15+) PCX.

Fish, I'll throw you a wave as a pass Dayton-Yellow Springs. Know that town pretty well - got two degrees there!

The plan is not to cut a deal today, just get my butt on everything. I think between New Carlyle and Springfield, I will have most manufacturers covered (no Genuine, SYM, or Lance) and get a fresh take on everything.

But first, son's soccer game, daughter's cheerleading, and a heck of a lot of cat herding.

More updates to follow...

[Wingscribe]

Just back from my jaunt up north. Impressions per bike:

PCX: Same as it has alwasy been, a benchmark in 150cc scootering - there if I need her.

Forza: Fits me better than I remember - am I shrinking? Weight seems the same on the side stand as the PCX...incorrect, but just an observation.

Downtown: Less room than the Forza for my legs. I love the color, but noooo...

Yammie Smacks: Same as always - if I could drive it with my knees, I would. Wait, they are already touching the handlebars...

Ruckus: I'll always love you, something about that little thing, but I need more than 50...

MP3: So goofy, I could not keep the smile off my face.

Vespa GTS 300 Super SE: Interesting, like my Buddy after some serious 'roid work. I had never looked too closely at these, but the fit and finish were astounding...really nice.

Notable absences from the showroom floors: People GTI and BV 350.

I'll have to keep looking...

[you you]

Just back from my jaunt up north. Impressions per bike:

PCX: Same as it has alwasy been, a benchmark in 150cc scootering - there if I need her.

Forza: Fits me better than I remember - am I shrinking? Weight seems the same on the side stand as the PCX...incorrect, but just an observation.

Downtown: Less room than the Forza for my legs. I love the color, but noooo...

Yammie Smacks: Same as always - if I could drive it with my knees, I would. Wait, they are already touching the handlebars...

Ruckus: I'll always love you, something about that little thing, but I need more than 50...

MP3: So goofy, I could not keep the smile off my face.

Vespa GTS 300 Super SE: Interesting, like my Buddy after some serious 'roid work. I had never looked too closely at these, but the fit and finish were astounding...really nice.

Notable absences from the showroom floors: People GTI and BV 350.

I'll have to keep looking...

For what?

[JohnL]

/quote]For what?[/quote]

The perfect ride. I found her but my wife won't let me bring her home

[fish]

I fit the Forza, at 6'3".....but if I brought my knees in fully they brushed the front. The Burgman 400 has an adjustable backrest. Moving it fully back makes for a super fit. Only 2",but makes the scooter so comfortable that I never give it a thought.
I did prefer the open handlebars of the Forza, roll them up to any position to fit you.
The few times I've been inside the panels of both the Forza and the Burgman....I came away impressed with the workmanship in there.
Forza made in Thailand, Burgman in Japan.
Well glad the dealer moved the two BV350s he had. One ea. color.
Hope to meet the owners some day around here.
I'd have a Forza and a BV350 if I could. Tested a lightly used BV 500, amazing bike.
Fish

[JohnL]

I was talking about a Honda CTX700D with DCT, but you all knew that of course.

[Wingscribe]

Test Rode the PCX and Forza tonight...

Let me tell you what, for bikes that are so similar, they are really different (I'll try to make some sense of that last comment).

Rode the Forza first: Felt like it was 18 inches high and nine feet long. At almost double the weight of the only other bike I have ridden, it was a pretty big culture shock. Seating position felt much more like a cruiser than I though it would, and I was about to rip off that back rest in the middle of traffic - that change will have to happen if I go there.

PCX was second: After the 300cc Forza, the power seemed...adequate? It was actually much quieter than the Forza - it was strange to see the speedo climb as no noise at all is coming from the bike (the Prima on my Buddy is a little on the loud side). This one REALLY needs a windscreen (there is a larger one available, right???) and the seating position was better than the Forza, but not perfect...might also need some seat work if that one happens.

Both bikes had great breaks, smooth as butter acceleration, and were a real pleasure to ride. Both also transmitted every pot hole right to my spine, but I can take it - might be a new bike thing, or just me white-knuckling the whole way.

I like them both a lot. Neither one is perfect for me (doubt that anything is, life is all about compromise) but I really have to think hard about which way to go.

Good news is that I don't think any choice is necessarily wrong...like I said they are both really nice, just different from each other.

Yeah, first world problems....