The Honda PCX / Forza / ADV150 / SH Forums

The 1300 were dogs as they used the old BL Series engine. But honestly the 1750s were great. Burn off an RS 2000 easily

Alibally wrote:Did you dad not like you then?

Quite the opposite, sold me the car for 150 quid and after a month I traded it in for an XR3 and got over twice what I paid for it in part exchange. So he did me a favour

qed wrote:The 1300 were dogs as they used the old BL Series engine. But honestly the 1750s were great. Burn off an RS 2000 easily

Having driven my mates 1750 and also another mates rs2000 mark 2 I would agree with you the 1750 was faster in a sprint by a bit but I think it had a slower overall speed.

I just worked in a warehouse at that age and could afford to insure all sorts of cars while these days the kids gotta pay out several 1000 quid just for a tiny 1 litre old banger. We was lucky back then

TC3 wrote:

Alibally wrote:Did you dad not like you then?

Quite the opposite, sold me the car for 150 quid and after a month I traded it in for an XR3 and got over twice what I paid for it in part exchange. So he did me a favour

Excellent. Good call.

TC3 wrote:Looks like a girlie scooter to me. Something you would paint pink and give to a teenager. Really can not take the design seriously but being and knowing Italians plenty will buy it just to be different

Alibally wrote:There's a lot of rose coloured glasses here. Looks like a load of old fashioned crap to me. Nobody would buy a 1950's car for the same price of a modern one.

Couldn't have said it better -- I think the scooter will be a huge flop. It's ugly as sin and completely nonfunctional. GN2's right, the drivetrain's solid, but I'd be much more likely to get something with underseat storage that didn't cost as much as my car.

But the people who want a Vespa will buy it because it is a Vespa.
It's no less functional than the PX and it's been on sale for years.

We don't get the PX here in the states anymore, no one will buy it. The closest thing to a PX we get is the Genuine Stella, and most people who ride them DESPISE them until they are forced to learn how to repair them, then it becomes a labor of love...

It's a pity you don't get the PX, it was resurrected by Vespa because of how many Stars LML were selling.
You can even get one delivered with your groceries: linky

gn2 wrote: linky

Sliding a bit off topic here,…

The 4-stroke Star sells for 25% more than the 2-stroke. There are nearly zero 2-stroke scooters for sale in the US anymore (pollution and noise), so I have very little knowledge in 2-stroke engines other than what I know about power garden tools.

In the low budget scooter market, isn’t a 2-stroke much more desirable than a 4-stroke? Don’t you get more power from a 2-stroke? Is there a gain in speed? Aside from being louder, is there more vibration? Is there a difference in gas mileage?

It would seem difficult to sell a 4-stroke alongside a similar 2-stroke especially if it cost 25% more. No?

2-strokes are less efficient and a lot less durable. You'll hear about Honda Goldwings going for a quarter million miles on the same engine, whereas you'd be lucky to get even a tenth of that out of a 2 stroke, or at least before a top-end rebuild.

4 strokes are quieter and less dirty, plus you don't have to worry about premixing oil. They're way better than 2-strokes. To give you an idea, my KTM 125SX needs a top-end rebuild every 50 hours or so, it's a two stroke. A top-end rebuild isn't too expensive, but is considered regular maintenance. On a four-stroke, a top-end rebuild is completely unexpected, because the piston rings and cylinders are much more well-lubricated and less abused, so they last and last and last. If you rode your PCX for 50 hours, averaging 40mph, you're looking at at least 2 rebuilds a year assuming you put 4000 miles on your scooter per year (which is not a lot).

That's why I said the Stellas are a labor of love. People who own them or vintage 2-stroke Vespas are always tearing them apart to replace things that break (ALL THE TIME). At least half of the members of our local vintage Vespa club own 2 or more scooters, one to ride until it breaks, and the other already broken, getting fixed up for when the first one breaks.

^ I should note that the Vespas I'm talking about above are VINTAGE -- the modern 4T Vespas are solid, reliable tanks of scooters.

Two strokes are more fun and smell fantastic

Not all two strokes are created equal.
A good modern two stroke engine properly run in and using good quality oil will last a very long time.
Working on a two stroke is much simpler than on a four stroke.
Keep the 2T oil topped up, change the gearbox oil and sparkplug, check the throttle/mixer cable and that's pretty much it. (no valves to check)
On a PX/Star all of this can be done without taking acres of tupperware off...

gn2 wrote:Not all two strokes are created equal.
A good modern two stroke engine properly run in and using good quality oil will last a very long time.
Working on a two stroke is much simpler than on a four stroke.
Keep the 2T oil topped up, change the gearbox oil and sparkplug, check the throttle/mixer cable and that's pretty much it. (no valves to check)
On a PX/Star all of this can be done without taking acres of tupperware off...

And a decoke once in a while...