The Honda PCX / Forza / ADV150 / SH Forums

At a traffic light. I had my idle stop engaged although I had been reluctant to use it lately, having found out that it took her some effort to start her engine in the mornings. Told so at the dealership for the 4000 kms inspection and the workshop supervisor told me they have been warned about a bad batch of batteries. We had a short conversation about it and as he knows I participate in this and another -spanish- forum, he told me about a thread in which there was this link:

http://world.honda.com/motorcycle-techo ... op/p4.html

There you can find how the idle/stop and battery charging system on the PCX works. It basically says that the stator won't charge during acceleration, but will do so under deceleration and constant speed.

I had, as I say, avoiding to use the idle stop but this guy told me that I could use, provided that I didn't abuse it. "Abusing it" meant disengaging it if the distance from A to B was very short. I had been doing that during the last two weeks and today, it went flat. I was so close to the Honda dealer that I could push the bike in, no need for towing. Once there, this guy tells me that "he will try to get a new battery under warranty" . I replied that there was still one year of effective warranty and then, his answer was that batteries weren't covered by that warranty, as was the case with brake pads, belts, tyres, etc...

Fair enough, I thought. I wasn't happy with that and I will be looking into it (thoroughly) tomorrow morning. I'll get in touch with the right authorities (office for consumer's protection, basically) and find out. Best for them if he's not trying to bullshit me because I'll get in touch via "burofax" (kind of a letter which is formally delivered and whose contents are considered legal evidence) with Honda Spain relating the matter, and forward everything to Honda Europa in the UK. The new battery costs nearly 120€.

I'm very, very, very pissed off. The bike is 5000 kms now and one year old. Now these guys say it's not under warranty. But what they'll find out is that they're fucking with the wrong guy.

Cascanciu wrote:At a traffic light. I had my idle stop engaged although I had been reluctant to use it lately, having found out that it took her some effort to start her engine in the mornings. Told so at the dealership for the 4000 kms inspection and the workshop supervisor told me they have been warned about a bad batch of batteries. We had a short conversation about it and as he knows I participate in this and another -spanish- forum, he told me about a thread in which there was this link:

http://world.honda.com/motorcycle-techo ... op/p4.html

There you can find how the idle/stop and battery charging system on the PCX works. It basically says that the stator won't charge during acceleration, but will do so under deceleration and constant speed.

I had, as I say, avoiding to use the idle stop but this guy told me that I could use, provided that I didn't abuse it. "Abusing it" meant disengaging it if the distance from A to B was very short. I had been doing that during the last two weeks and today, it went flat. I was so close to the Honda dealer that I could push the bike in, no need for towing. Once there, this guy tells me that "he will try to get a new battery under warranty" . I replied that there was still one year of effective warranty and then, his answer was that batteries weren't covered by that warranty, as was the case with brake pads, belts, tyres, etc...

Fair enough, I thought. I wasn't happy with that and I will be looking into it (thoroughly) tomorrow morning. I'll get in touch with the right authorities (office for consumer's protection, basically) and find out. Best for them if he's not trying to bullshit me because I'll get in touch via "burofax" (kind of a letter which is formally delivered and whose contents are considered legal evidence) with Honda Spain relating the matter, and forward everything to Honda Europa in the UK. The new battery costs nearly 120€.

I'm very, very, very pissed off. The bike is 5000 kms now and one year old. Now these guys say it's not under warranty. But what they'll find out is that they're fucking with the wrong guy.

Honda must be shitting themselves

Precedent has been set already, there are members on here who have had replacement batteries under warranty, its a known problem.
No reason why you shouldn't get one too, so try to be calm..... and be nice to the dealer

gn2 wrote:Precedent has been set already, there are members on here who have had replacement batteries under warranty, its a known problem.
No reason why you shouldn't get one too, so try to be calm..... and be nice to the dealer

I've been nice to the dealer today and plan on being nice to them in the future. The dealer is aware of the bad batteries issue and quite frankly, I don't think they're the problem. In fact, my suspicion is that it is Honda Spain the one that is refusing to replace the batteries under warranty and not accepting the warranty claims from the dealers. Therefore, I'll place the above mentioned formal letter to them and send a copy to the consumer's protection office (which works pretty well in this country) and file a complaint if they don't accept to replace my battery, apart from informing Honda Europe of the whole process. E-mails to various motorbike publications will be the next move.

I might end up having to pay for a new battery, but before that I'll make as much noise as I can.

Cascanciu wrote:

gn2 wrote:Precedent has been set already, there are members on here who have had replacement batteries under warranty, its a known problem.
No reason why you shouldn't get one too, so try to be calm..... and be nice to the dealer

I've been nice to the dealer today and plan on being nice to them in the future. The dealer is aware of the bad batteries issue and quite frankly, I don't think they're the problem. In fact, my suspicion is that it is Honda Spain the one that is refusing to replace the batteries under warranty and not accepting the warranty claims from the dealers. Therefore, I'll place the above mentioned formal letter to them and send a copy to the consumer's protection office (which works pretty well in this country) and file a complaint if they don't accept to replace my battery, apart from informing Honda Europe of the whole process. E-mails to various motorbike publications will be the next move.

I might end up having to pay for a new battery, but before that I'll make as much noise as I can.

You could just chill and buy a new battery. €30 would sort it and then you could get back to enjoying life?

you you wrote:

Cascanciu wrote:

gn2 wrote:Precedent has been set already, there are members on here who have had replacement batteries under warranty, its a known problem.
No reason why you shouldn't get one too, so try to be calm..... and be nice to the dealer

I've been nice to the dealer today and plan on being nice to them in the future. The dealer is aware of the bad batteries issue and quite frankly, I don't think they're the problem. In fact, my suspicion is that it is Honda Spain the one that is refusing to replace the batteries under warranty and not accepting the warranty claims from the dealers. Therefore, I'll place the above mentioned formal letter to them and send a copy to the consumer's protection office (which works pretty well in this country) and file a complaint if they don't accept to replace my battery, apart from informing Honda Europe of the whole process. E-mails to various motorbike publications will be the next move.

I might end up having to pay for a new battery, but before that I'll make as much noise as I can.

You could just chill and buy a new battery. €30 would sort it and then you could get back to enjoying life?

According to the dealer, a new battery is 120€ as stated above. I presume they refer to the OEM battery and assume an aftermarket one will be cheaper, but it's this "battery not covered by the warranty" arrogance that bothers me. That and the fact that if they've put into the market a system that has flaws, it's not the customers the ones who are supposed to pay for them. Neither 30€ nor 120 would get me bankrupt, and you're right to some extent, but I'm the kind of person who fulfills obligations and exercises his rights. As said, I might end up having to buy a new one, but then I'll try my best to be a pain in the arse as much as I can.

I have a friend who had a weird problem in his Honda Accord 2.4 VTEC. The car was a manual (even weirder) and the problem was so uncommon that the local dealer didn't have spare parts to repair the car and had to order them from Honda Europe (located in Swindon, UK, if I recall correctly). He ended up having his car repaired free of charge (and was way out of warranty) since Honda Europe considered "unacceptable" that kind of failure in one of his products. He was unable to describe the problem, he just said "transmission" and my thought is that it had to be with the gearbox, but who knows what exactly it was. What I mean with this is that I'm aware that Honda is the kind of company that stands by their products, but I'm afraid some arrogant prick in Madrid is refusing to accept legit warranty claims in order to save money for the company, perhaps thinking that one to be a good way to climb up the ladder. Well, wrong. It's just a good way to lose customers.

Picked her up this morning. Bad and good news. The bad news, Honda Spain refused to provide a new battery. The good news, the dealer has installed a new one for free. As said, I was happy with them so far and I'm now happier. The workshop manager told me that they had replaced some fifteen -or so- batteries due to this known problem, but looks like there's been a change of policy and now Honda Spain is attributing the problem to the customers, for an alleged negligence in the use of the idle stop system, as explained in the first post. "Then they should have put a warning in the user's manual" was my reply and he agreed, but the fact is that they're no longer supplying new batteries and charging the costs to the customers. The actual problem is a bad batch of batteries, not the idle stop system "per se".

Those guys at the dealer deserve a beer after work and they'll get it. And perhaps Honda Europe should know what they're doing at Honda Spain. It got my attention that people is getting batteries replaced all around the globe (as seen here) but not in Spain.

A happy ending for you, but there will probably be others not so lucky.
In the UK we have an organisation called "Trading Standards" who deal with consumer protection, if there's a Spanish equivalent I think you should definitely bring this issue to their attention.

gn2 wrote:A happy ending for you, but there will probably be others not so lucky.
In the UK we have an organisation called "Trading Standards" who deal with consumer protection, if there's a Spanish equivalent I think you should definitely bring this issue to their attention.

Yeah, there is an equivalent. And it works well. Usually, they try to get both parts involved to an agreement, but if that fails and they see the consumer's rights have been abused, they'll provide assistance or even take action against the abusing business/company. And I definitely feel like letting them know.

Isn't the contract with the dealer in the first instance and its them that need to make it good

you you wrote:Isn't the contract with the dealer in the first instance and its them that need to make it good

That's correct, but it's not the dealer the one who fitted the bike with a faulty battery , nor they knew there was a bad batch of batteries. Therefore, they shouldn't be responsible for it.

Cascanciu wrote:http://world.honda.com/motorcycle-techo ... op/p4.html

Link no good.

cessna151 wrote:

Cascanciu wrote:http://world.honda.com/motorcycle-techo ... op/p4.html

Link no good.

Try this:
http://world.honda.com/motorcycle-pictu ... index.html

Cascanciu wrote:At a traffic light. I had my idle stop engaged although I had been reluctant to use it lately

Hey same thing happened to me couple of weeks ago,had to push it to work some 500m away,but in my case my battery is some 3 years old and 12000miles on it. Luckily ive got a trickle charger that tops it up and its fine (i dont use stop/start any more) but if i leave it for a few days without riding it will start to go weak again,enough not to want to crank the engine..

Cascanciu wrote:

you you wrote:Isn't the contract with the dealer in the first instance and its them that need to make it good

That's correct, but it's not the dealer the one who fitted the bike with a faulty battery , nor they knew there was a bad batch of batteries. Therefore, they shouldn't be responsible for it.

They are over here as they sold it to you

My hubby just took his Honda PCX in due to flat battery but here in the UK the battery is covered byt he warranty. If you do only short journeys (like my hubby) then the battery will use more juice than it puts back so over time the battery will just die. Consider getting a battery charger, not a car one as the batteries are new gel ones. Put it on charge and see if that makes it work any better.

We were told it's a bit like your mobile phone battery needs topping up everynow and again....




White Honda PCX Owner.

hondapcx.tumbler.com
www.blueeyescomputers.co.uk

Getting a battery charger is not a bad idea, Lynny. I usually do short commutes, ten to fifteen minutes on the bike, and do a few of those every day. I have stopped using the idle stop for the moment and will use it during hot summer days only (provided that we get a decent summer in the miserably rainy north of Spain).

Thing is, I plan on getting a full bike licence soon. Well, not "full" because it's the A2 licence that will entitle me to ride bikes up to 47 hp. If things go as per the plan, I'll have the PCX for some six months to a year, then get a bigger scooter, on the 300-400 cc range.