The Honda PCX / Forza / ADV150 / SH Forums

This, unfortunately, is a good reason that you should leave the teaching to the professionals...

http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/inde ... _ride.html

Sounds like it was WAY too much bike for her to be learning on...

I say you are right on the "too big to learn on" part. But I wonder how fast she was going to have been killed from head trauma even with a helmet. Of coarse it might have been the wrong size helmet or one of those skull cap types that offer little protection.

speedandstyle wrote:I say you are right on the "too big to learn on" part. But I wonder how fast she was going to have been killed from head trauma even with a helmet. Of coarse it might have been the wrong size helmet or one of those skull cap types that offer little protection.

I have seen so many who don't even put chin strap on. At my rider training the instructor ripped a new one in a couple people who tried to get on the bike without chin strap being fastened. Tough to say but it sounds like this person was not correctly checked over by the bike owner on safety aspects and pure stupidity to start on a Harley.

You might be surprised to learn just how slow the impact speeds helmets are tested for.

Wearing a helmet is no guarantee for safety, it just helps. Not just biking but also skiing where several people die every year from head injury skiing/boarding even though they wear helmets. Last year an experienced ski rep collided with a 'padded' snow blower in good conditions and on-piste and died from head injury despite wearing a helmet, and a woman died some months back colliding with a tree (she wore a helmet too). Strangely it seems these are not broken neck injuries from the impact, just impact to the skull through the helmet.

Many years ago i read of an accident in which the parents bought their child an off road motorcycle for Christmas and he died that same day from head trauma when he lost control in their back yard and hit a tree. He had a helmet on. A lot of good it did him,

Presumably he would have been just as dead without a helmet.
Safety gear doesn't eliminate risk, it reduces risk.

By the way, when I turned 18, I was in the military and had never driven before. I was an X-ray tech fresh out of military training school when I went to my permanent base out in nowhere land (west Texas). If you didn't have a vehicle you had to walk to town, and everywhere else. I bought a Harley Sportster from a patient who had just crashed his Triumph motorcycle and needed money to repair it. He was in a cast from head to toe. His riding friend took me out to a deserted back country road and taught me how to ride by having me stay in 1st gear while riding up and down the road. Then he taught me to shift up and down to 2nd gear. We practiced for several days before he let me ride that road at 35 mph back and forth for a mile. Some of those roads hadn't seen traffic for years. This was one of those roads. After a week i could ride quite well. Then i practiced turns and other things that would be on the driving test. He got me the book, and I got my license. I got my license to drive a car a year later. If you are young, and you have plenty of time and space, you can learn on a Harley. I wouldn't recommend it on a Sporster, though. It turned out to be a good and a bad learning tool. Good in that i learned how to control a beast. Bad because it was a beast, and when it wanted to fall over, it would fall over. A riding buddy bought the small Harley 150 at the time and he had a lot less balance issues....but then i could ride 2 up. He couldn't. Like I said, good and bad.

gn2 wrote:Presumably he would have been just as dead without a helmet.
Safety gear doesn't eliminate risk, it reduces risk.

Precisely.

It also doesn't seem like the helmet was protecting anything worthwhile, as anyone with a functioning brain should be well aware that a liter bike might not be the best place to start out.

Teaching your friends to ride isn't a bad idea, it just requires that one of the two parties be the reasonable one.

Mel46 wrote:By the way, when I turned 18, I was in the military and had never driven before. I was an X-ray tech fresh out of military training school when I went to my permanent base out in nowhere land (west Texas). If you didn't have a vehicle you had to walk to town, and everywhere else. I bought a Harley Sportster from a patient who had just crashed his Triumph motorcycle and needed money to repair it. He was in a cast from head to toe. His riding friend took me out to a deserted back country road and taught me how to ride by having me stay in 1st gear while riding up and down the road. Then he taught me to shift up and down to 2nd gear. We practiced for several days before he let me ride that road at 35 mph back and forth for a mile. Some of those roads hadn't seen traffic for years. This was one of those roads. After a week i could ride quite well. Then i practiced turns and other things that would be on the driving test. He got me the book, and I got my license. I got my license to drive a car a year later. If you are young, and you have plenty of time and space, you can learn on a Harley. I wouldn't recommend it on a Sporster, though. It turned out to be a good and a bad learning tool. Good in that i learned how to control a beast. Bad because it was a beast, and when it wanted to fall over, it would fall over. A riding buddy bought the small Harley 150 at the time and he had a lot less balance issues....but then i could ride 2 up. He couldn't. Like I said, good and bad.

Non of my business but does being an X-ray technician have any part in the leukaemia?

I would hope not. However, one thing that i definitely do know contributed was that my doctor put me on a testosterone gel, and right on the packaging it said "can cause cancer" . I questioned the doctor about it and she said that they have to put that on the packaging. She said that they put it on all hormone therapy treatments. I used it for one month before i took myself off. Within a couple of months of quitting i was diagnosed with leukemia. Just say no to that stuff!

gn2 wrote:You might be surprised to learn just how slow the impact speeds helmets are tested for.

We were told by an instructor on the Performance plus day at Cadwell Park in May...

18mph I believe he said ..... the crowd went earily silent

ECE 22-05 > Impact absorption testing is performed in a manner very similar to the DOT standard, involving a drop test from a fixed height on a steel anvil with a headform fitted inside to measure the energy transmitted. Peak acceleration energy at the headform allowed to pass the test is 275 G. Impact absorption and rotational forces are also tested at points where any surfaces or parts project from the shell of the helmet. 275G's is a fair wack! There's a youtube video showing someone hitting a cheap China bought helmet and an approved helmet with a large lump hammer - the china one crumbles 1st swing but the DOT/ECE one takes all the punishment - just has some marks!

Even high-end helmets are just essentially a plastic shell with compressed styrofoam underneath. I'm well aware that the hundreds of dollars I shell out for one is largely for comfort, weight, and aerodynamics(which you'll learn to appreciate as you go on the freeways).

Well helmets must work fairly well. We have no law in Illinois to have a helmet and many will splatter they beanies to prove it. I would say all the cruiser crowd I see don't bother with helmets. Sport bikers seem to keep it on.

How many of you scooter fags wear helmets?

I would take offense at that term. However, for those of us who love our scooters and have moved down to them from big bikes because of the fun factor, we can be injured just as much on a scooter as on a bigger bike. I haven't seen any older riders on scooters not wearing a helmet.
However:
I have seen young people who obviously don't think they can be injured on a scooter. I saw a young girl, probably a teen, riding her scooter at 45 mph (the speed limit on the particular street she was on) with the following as her attire: flip flops, bathing suit top, shorts, and a helmet that was not buckled. Oh, and no eye protection either.

Mel46 wrote:I would take offense at that term.

You are right Mel, I apologize I was off my meds and coming away from another thread when I posted.
http://www.hondapcx.org/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=4749

Mel46 wrote:I would take offense at that term. However, for those of us who love our scooters and have moved down to them from big bikes because of the fun factor, we can be injured just as much on a scooter as on a bigger bike. I haven't seen any older riders on scooters not wearing a helmet.
However:
I have seen young people who obviously don't think they can be injured on a scooter. I saw a young girl, probably a teen, riding her scooter at 45 mph (the speed limit on the particular street she was on) with the following as her attire: flip flops, bathing suit top, shorts, and a helmet that was not buckled. Oh, and no eye protection either.

ive rode big machines for38 years. sold my Goldwing 5 years ago. me and the woman bought 2 pcxs. 4 weeks in we were in a parking lot for her to practice, I was in a slite corner, hit the brakes and slide at least 5 foot, cracked 2 ribs,and hit my helmet on pavement. it was like it hit a pach of ice. still don't know exectly what happened I was on my ass before I knew it.maybe less weight bike ?????

homie wrote:

Mel46 wrote:I would take offense at that term.

You are right Mel, I apologize I was off my meds and coming away from another thread when I posted.
http://www.hondapcx.org/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=4749

It's almost a term of endearment over here

earlleecliffton wrote:still don't know exectly what happened

You probably locked the front wheel.
Best not to "hit" the brakes, squeeze them gently to begin with and work up from there.