Really Awful Brakes

[davenowherejones]

The bad noise coming from my Forza rear end sounds like I have worn out another set of brake pads in 5000 miles (8300 km). I have to buy another muffler gasket and pull it off to see if I am down to metal again. I think I will buy a cheap set of pads because the expensive ones don't seem to last.

What a crappy design. How do we get Honda to fix their mistakes? Or do we just pay and pay and pay?

I took a Burgman 400 out for a test ride today. It feels more like a highway bike than the Honda wannabe. A lot of Honda false advertising. It is not even a 300 like they claim in the name. What a bunch of liars and cheats.

[davenowherejones]

$110 every 3 months is going to add up quickly.

[DioTiAma]

Psssst, sell it. Told you so once before...

Seems like you've got the bad apple. Sell it and wait for the K50!

[gn2]

$110 every 3 months is going to add up quickly.

What are you spending that on?

[davenowherejones]

$110 every 3 months is going to add up quickly.

What are you spending that on?

Front & rear factory pads

[gn2]

Sounds extremely expensive.
I can get a set of front and rear pads for under £20 simply by avoiding the Honda dealer.

Some items I've bought recently:

Rear

Front

Exhaust connection gasket

Stainless exhaust clamp 36-39mm

[davenowherejones]

Sounds extremely expensive.
I can get a set of front and rear pads for under £20 simply by avoiding the Honda dealer.

Some items I've bought recently:

Rear

Front

Exhaust connection gasket

Stainless exhaust clamp 36-39mm

The international shipping to Canada is the biggest problem. The 1.67 pound clamp is 14.51 pounds shipping to Canada and it takes forever (1 month) to get here. The same with items shipped from China.

I ordered slightly cheaper pads from a second source through my dealer and it will still take a week to get here. It will cost at least $25 to go get them.

[davenowherejones]

So now the Forza gets parked for a week till I get new pads. I might have to do some actual work around the house. Bummer.

[beegmouse]

Try using just the front for a journey and then feel how hot the back caliper is.
Does the wheel spin freely?

Maybe your combi brake isn't balancing the load and you are using the back all the time.

[gn2]

The reason the back wears so fast is because no matter what you do it will not release fully.

[davenowherejones]

The reason the back wears so fast is because no matter what you do it will not release fully.

I think you are right. The very poor location means it gets full of mud from the wheel and then the adjacent muffler bakes it in place. I think the heat shield is inadequate.

Someone is going to get seriously injured because of the faulty engineering.

Someone in the USA needs to get a class-action lawsuit going over this because that is the only thing to get big corporations to do anything.

It would be cheaper for Honda to buy back all of the Forza's around here. A poorly engineered scooter that does not sell well in Canada.

[davenowherejones]

Try using just the front for a journey and then feel how hot the back caliper is.
Does the wheel spin freely?

Maybe your combi brake isn't balancing the load and you are using the back all the time.

The back wheel is always hot. I think the dragging brakes heat it up. The wheel does not spin freely because the brakes are dragging.

The combi brakes do nothing when you use only the front brakes. The combi brakes only work when you use the rear brakes and it uses one pot of the three on the front caliber. The combi brakes are because dumb Americans on Harleys tend to use their rear brakes only and crash a lot. The rest of the world is not afraid of using the front brakes and knows how to use them.

[montliz44]

Question, Dave:

Do you usually apply both brakes when you slow down? That would be a perfectly legit thing to do, and that's what the owners' manual recommends, but many riders, including me, only apply the rear brake if the front doesn't appear to be going to get us stopped in time, and then only for a second or two. Lots of bikes have weak and quick-wearing rear brakes, including high-dollar bikes like my BMW, so it's just a habit I've gotten into.

You have more miles on your Forza than I do, and you may already avoid using the rear, but I was curious to know how you did yours. Since I've been aware of this Forza problem since before I bought mine, I never touch the rear brake unless I have to (which actually happens fairly often, since the front brake isn't very good either).

Johnny

[davenowherejones]

Question, Dave:

Do you usually apply both brakes when you slow down? That would be a perfectly legit thing to do, and that's what the owners' manual recommends, but many riders, including me, only apply the rear brake if the front doesn't appear to be going to get us stopped in time, and then only for a second or two. Lots of bikes have weak and quick-wearing rear brakes, including high-dollar bikes like my BMW, so it's just a habit I've gotten into.

You have more miles on your Forza than I do, and you may already avoid using the rear, but I was curious to know how you did yours. Since I've been aware of this Forza problem since before I bought mine, I never touch the rear brake unless I have to (which actually happens fairly often, since the front brake isn't very good either).

Johnny

I have ridden many different brands of motorcycles and owned several. I have ridden about 200,000 (?) km. I have used all of the brakes available when needed. My DR650 is at 67,000 km and I am only on the second set of rear pads. I figured a modern scooter like the Forza with ABS would have working brakes. It can stop really quickly when it has all of the pads.

I consider it perfectly unacceptable to not be able to use all of the brakes. That is just plain idiotic engineering.

Using just the front only to get around bad design is stupid but it might have to be done till I can buy a machine that wasn't made by fools. I always thought Honda was a quality manufacturer. I guess times have changed.

[gn2]

The front only strategy makes no difference because to start the scooter you have to apply the rear brake fully. Then it doesn't release and drags.

[davenowherejones]

The front only strategy makes no difference because to start the scooter you have to apply the rear brake fully. Then it doesn't release and drags.

I think it doesn't release because it is full of mud. I want to have a good look at my fenders. Pouring rain right now.

My MacBook does some weird auto-corrects on me. It also has a tough time not talking American. Canada uses British English but I think British English is a dying language. Half the people of Britain don't speak English it seems.

[montliz44]

@Dave, I certainly agree with you about Honda's poor engineering on the Forza rear brake, and I take it that the answer to my question is that yes, you do use both brakes most of the time, so that confirms my thinking on the excessive rear brake wear. (you're doing the right thing; Honda just hasn't provided you the right stuff to do it with).

@GN2, I'm not having sticking and dragging problems with mine; I check it for freewheeling every day on my pre-trip inspection. That of course doesn't mean it couldn't start sticking any time.

Johnny

[davenowherejones]

I pulled the caliper off and looked at the brake pads. The brake pad slides on a stainless steel slider at both ends. There is very little room between the slider and the pad. There is a knife edge on the slider that digs in to the pad. The pads are stamped out of steel and have rough edges.

When I get my new pads I am going to take a jewellers file and smooth out any rough edges.

[davenowherejones]

Short arrows are friction points

[davenowherejones]

Did anyone get my picture?